SkeptiSys

August 27, 2007

Michael Vick’s Vapo-rub

Filed under: Uncategorized — skeptisys @ 2:22 pm

Apparently, Michael Vick of the NFL Atlanta Falcons, or Ron Mexico, is allegedly guilty of involvement in an alleged dog fighting ring where alleged dogs were allegedly killed for fun and allegedly gambling, allegedly.   I hope that’s enough ‘alleged’s but I am sure people are forced to plead guilty to crimes they never committed to accept the plea bargain rather than risk a harsher sentence after a financially and emotionally draining trial    Besides, I have no better idea of his guilt than you or any ‘journalist’ does.   Luckily, ignorance never stopped people from commenting,  declaring Vick the worst villain mastermind since Saddam Hussein was caught.  

For the purposes of this article only, I am assuming that Vick is guilty, because I want to examine some underlying issues.

Vick’s treatment in the PR-Media (formerly Mainstream Media) is easy to classify, as this story has been the topic of many news items.  Vick has been utterly trashed more than Lindsay Lohan recently.  (Not that I even know who Lindsay Lohan is, other than a character on TV who takes lots of drugs, allegedly).  In the press, even Jon Stewart of the Daily Show is criticizing Vick’s behavior.  The criticism is much louder than you hear for wife beating (Bobby Cox?), for example.

Some reports say that Vick’s dog fighting rings contained torture, which is just horrible.  Somehow, the outrage for a rumor of dog torturing is more than the proof of actual torture of human beings.   Perhaps that is because the PR reports (TV news) are put out by the same companies that profit from war activities. 

So clearly, Vick’s actions have been classified as worse than beating women or torturing humans.  The NFL also feels the same way, as they have suspended Vick and publicly admonished him, while ignoring the cases where players are accused of hitting women.       

My personal feelings are that killing dogs for fun and sport is disgusting and vile.  I also think killing deer and pheasant for fun and sport is just as disgusting and vile.  In fact, hunting and dog fighting are very similar.  Consider that they both: involve killing of cute animals, like deer and dogs (ok, so the dogs aren’t cute, they are mean pit bulls, like Karl Rove with less frothing at the mouth).  Both activities are dangerous to people, although hunting is probably more dangerous considering gun accidents and Cheney style hunting accidents.  In fact, I can only think of a few distinct differences:

1)       some hunters eat what they kill, although few appear to kill solely for food

2)     dog fighting is mainly done by the lower classes of society, in America these lower classes are referred to as ‘Black’, even if they include poor Whites.  This may account for the difference in applicable laws.

3)     Hats.  One group wears bright orange goofy hats, while the other wears baseball caps over to the side.  Advantage, dog-fighting.

All in all, I think it is objectively clear that hunting and dog fighting are in the same group.  Morally, I feel the same way about Vick as I do Todd Helton and the other people who kill for fun and sport.  They all have committed horrible acts that do not deserve losing freedom and career for a number of years, like Vick.      

At least Vick’s sentence will be more compassionate than the one the authorities are handing out to the dogs involved.  Yes that’s right, the same system that condemns Vick for killing dogs is about to kill those dogs themselves.  

 

14 Comments »

  1. I’ll tell you what.

    My grandpappy always used to say “Sometimes justice involves getting down on all fours and getting made up with body paint to look like a fire hydrant”

    Seems to me this is one of those times.

    The jails are already overcrowded with people that smoke pot and stuff.

    Comment by urbanshocker — August 27, 2007 @ 4:12 pm

  2. Whether he’s guilty or not, my TV has got me so upset about this Mr. Vick that I think they should make HIM perform some sort of gladitorial sport every Sunday…being chased and pummeled by others from his same species that would tear him to shreds were it not for the regulators of said event.

    If he prevails, give him all the steak, biscuits and doggy style fun he can handle.

    However, if he loses, he should be subjected to the most drawn out, torturous death known to man: bad investments, gold-digging wives, chronic arthritis, shrinkage from roid rage affiliated actions, suicide from depression.

    Comment by Jerry Don Gleaton — August 27, 2007 @ 4:17 pm

  3. Hunting Deer and Killing dogs are two different things. It is sad that hunting has to be brought into this.

    Hunting Forums

    Comment by Jim — August 28, 2007 @ 2:36 am

  4. Urban: Your grand pappy seems like a fascinating and wise man. I suspect Vick will soon be receiving similar advice. Agreed, the prisons are too crowded with people that committed nonviolent crimes.
    Pot is so harmless, that it is just shameful how many people are locked up for many years. Especially when the worst possible symptoms of pot are exhibited by Bush and other neocons. Bush is always inappropriately smiling, and so many of them have no short term memory whatsoever. Gonzales has forgotten everything that happened since he got out of middle school, for Zeus sake. They must all be completely stoned. “Um, what, huh. Who was the enemy, again? Huh huh let’s bomb them”

    Comment by skeptisys — August 28, 2007 @ 3:26 am

  5. Jerry: You have interesting ideas that many would agree with, and should all be televised. Thanks for your creative post. One other idea I left out of my initial post:
    NFL is entertainment, but the commissioner is suspending the most entertaining player around, thereby punishing the fans. His punishment should be to play extra football. After the games he should play for charity groups and halftime at the Georgia Tech football games.

    Comment by skeptisys — August 28, 2007 @ 3:36 am

  6. Jim:
    Thanks for the post. I admit that I never hunted nor attended a dog fight, which is a benefit when it comes to objectivity, but a detraction when it comes to experience. We need someone who has actively participated in both activities and can share those experiences. But since Hunter Thompson is sadly dead, we will have to do it ourselves.
    So…
    The main objection of dog fighting is the killing, which also occurs in hunting. So, like beginning algebra, let’s remove the common denominators. Ok now hunting without killing is… paint ball. and dogfighting without killing is… Xbox I guess. So yeah, I guess they are different. I have to go with the video games though, personal preference.

    Comment by skeptisys — August 28, 2007 @ 3:49 am

  7. In hunting, you try to kill an animal to get it ( for food or its hide), for population control, or for kicks. Dog fighting is training dogs to be aggressive and watching them kill each other for kicks and also (here’s the key difference) – for money.

    The NFL has a bug up its butt about gambling. Encouraging brutal doggie death is such an ugly and/or hi-larious thing that it gets the spotlight. I wonder how much of Vic’s trouble with the NFL was due to the betting? I’d love to see the specific language in the contract.

    Comment by Jute Lincoln — August 28, 2007 @ 7:49 pm

  8. Good comment Jute,
    When I asked around, the #1 reason provided for why hunting was different was that people hunted mainly for food. I rejected this argument because a) it is not mainly done for food, and b) when it is, it is mainly to make or save money. How many hunters truly kill because they have no other options for food? Very few or none would be my guess. They may not have cheaper food options or tastier food options, but there are options.
    The population control argument can also be used to argue that we should open fire on people in Times Square. There are so many people in Manhattan that it is draining the resources to the point where some people can no longer get food and shelter. So it is humane to shoot them, goes the population control argument. I don’t buy it, although i wouldn’t mind less traffic going into the city. It is absurd, of course, to consider this humane. But hey, I have seen people on TV argue we make people in Iraq free by killing them, so who knows.

    The NFL did not suspend Vick because of gambling. They had already started to suspend players based on ‘poor attitude’, which was decided by the NFL commissioner, who answers to nobody but the owners. The case prior to Vick’s was one where a player was suspended for 1 full year because he had been questioned by police on a couple matters. He was not found guilt, nor was he even indicted, but he was certainly a black kid who was ‘up to no good’, in the one person’s eyes. These penalties are much harsher than any others before, and should be overturned on that alone – if the union challenged them.
    One other point, not only is the NFL a monopoly, but all of there suspensions have been upheld in the closest professional football league, the Canadian Football League. These players are suspended for all of North America, although SportsLaw has an interesting article on how that might work with Vick.
    http://sports-law.blogspot.com/2007/08/cfl.html
    If people really think that companies should use their force to fire their workers and blackball them from the industry because they do not like the type of person they are, many union activists will have died in vain. Athiests, Muslims, Jews, homosexuals, and any other ‘non-conformists’ should also beware.

    Comment by skeptisys — August 29, 2007 @ 12:24 am

  9. Population control in animals is morally equivalent to population control in humans? What are you, from PETA? Since we rip chickens’ legs off and eat them without asking permission first, why shouldn’t we do the same to people? It’s okay to remove the ovaries and uterus from your 1-year old cat, so why not your baby daughter? Nobody complains when you make your dog balance a dog biscuit on his nose until you say it’s okay to drop it, so why do people make faces when I make grandpa do it?

    Also, Mr. Touchy, I’m not advocating hunting — I’m just trying to discern the differences between hunting and dog fighting to see if I can figure out why the NFL (presumably) wouldn’t have a problem with Vic on a hunting trip but doesn’t approve of dog fighting.

    Comment by Jute Lincoln — August 29, 2007 @ 6:53 pm

  10. Jute, I have been called many names before, but this is a first time for me as Mr. Touchy. If you need to unwind, I hear hunting helps. My intention was not to claim that other animals are as important as humans, which I never believed. I did want to point out the hypocrisies of those who claim that Vick’s treatment of animals is out of line with what is generally accepted. Animals that are killed for food are treated horribly, and the poor treatment leads to dangerous diseases transmitted to humans. Nobody has spent a year in prison for that. Cute little fuzzy bunny rabbits are treated in tortuous ways for no better reason than finding yet another lipstick color. And yes, hunters breed animals just so they can gun them down for fun. These are all accepted, then why all of a sudden change and attack Vick?
    The NFL does not care about dogs. Heck they are now fighting to not pay money to humans who were hurt playing their dangerous game. They are just continuing their trend of using monopolistic power to recover salary and punishment of black players. Public outrage, tv coverage, and police involvement just gave them the opportunity.
    I hope that is more clear, Mr. Tightcolon.

    Comment by skeptisys — August 30, 2007 @ 5:00 pm

  11. Way to stoop to my level, Buttplug. The difference is intentional cruelty. The point of hunting is to kill. The point of chicken farming is to sell meat. The point of rabbit testing is testing. Any cruelty is a happy byproduct. How much death and suffering you’re willing to tollerate is an indicator of how big an asshole you are. In dog fighting, however, the brutality is integral to the goal. No over-the-top aggression, no fun and profit. Of course, Vick prolly learned his take-no-prisoners technique from his football coaches. Frankly, I’d be into fight-to-the-death football if for no other reason that then there’d be fewer asshole football players, but that’s just me.

    Comment by Jute Lincoln — August 30, 2007 @ 5:38 pm

  12. Jute, you ignorant slute. The point of mascara testing and chicken farming is to make money, which also happens to be the main goal of dogfighting, entertainment and money. They are similar in this way. The chicken farmer knows he is treating the chickens poorly, and intentionally does it anyway. In fact, he goes out of his way to treat them worse, because it will increase profits. What a disgusting human.
    I disagree with your argument that morality is defined by these intentions. If I kill you for money or lipstick, I am no more moral than if I kill you for fun. This is just an example. Maybe there is a difference in how much a person can justify to himself that he is moral, while committing tortuous killing. Tell me this, do you think a serial killer is more moral if he believes he is helping his victims go to heaven?
    You are correct about certain sports training causing more aggressive behavior, which may be why the players hunt so much, or join the ultimate hunting trip – the marines and army.
    Speaking of buttplugs, order your Barry Bonds vibrating one today!
    http://www.celebritybuttplugs.com/

    Comment by skeptisys — August 30, 2007 @ 6:23 pm

  13. Is it the pre-roids bonds or the post-roids bonds?

    Comment by Jute Lincoln — August 30, 2007 @ 6:57 pm

  14. Well that is up to you now, isn’t it?

    Comment by skeptisys — August 30, 2007 @ 7:03 pm


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